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406's Repair Thread

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    406's Repair Thread

    Hey everyone,

    Hope you’re all doing well and keeping busy. I decided it was time to start posting about my repair endeavors. I mainly have stuck to doing electronics recycling and small kitchen appliance repair (microwaves and such). However, I have expanded into doing major appliances for recycling/repair. Why would I do that? Money, time, and accessibility. Montana is a large state with cities being super spread out. Our closest major city is 150 miles one way. That means that sourcing electronics far away is an expensive challenge. I’m not getting out of ewaste, but I’ve wanted to play, I mean repair, appliances for several years, but just didn’t have the time. Well, you make time for what’s important to you and increasing my income is becoming important.

    We broke ground on building a house last June and have had things become more expensive than expected with increased delays too. We spent the bulk of last year trying to get someone to do our concrete (something that was very difficult because of how far out of town we are). To make a long story shorter, we found a company 2 weeks ago and am going full steam ahead on concrete/other projects. Additionally, we are trying to do this project without loans so a buffer of cash is essential.

    Now on to what this thread is going to be about:

    I get a lot of broken things in for recycling. Many of which are beyond repair. However, a solid 25% of what comes in can be repaired and sold for money. This thread will focus on what repairs I do each week. Some weeks it will be microwaves, other weeks it will be TV’s. You never know what’s going to come in for recycling/repair!

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    I recently picked up a nice frost free fridge a neighbour had put out to the curb, needs a new control board several hundred to replace but can be repaired for around $20.00 with 30 minutes soldering time.

    Capacitors have about a 10 year life span when one fails the whole board no longer functions. Caps gone bad are easily recognized by bulge the top of the canister but this is not always the case. Check the board for hot spots and burnt areas.

    For more specific information on the board your attempting to repair check out Youtube.

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    This week has been one for finishing up a bunch of random repair projects on the warehouse. I'm working through 4 fridges, 1 restaurant mini fridge, a wine cooler, and a mountain of TV's. Below is a breakdown of issues:

    I've been delving into doing french door fridges lately as the appliance shop that I work with absolutely refuse to learn how to fix them. Understandable when you're getting in 25+ appliances per day as a one man operation. What I've learned over the past month on these french door fridges:

    -LG linear compressors are crap and fail very quickly.
    -These fridges have a tiny amount of refrigerant compared to the older fridges.
    -There a butt ton and a half of flat surfaces in french door fridges that have to be cleaned.

    Now onto the repair details!

    1. Kitchenaid french door refrigerator (new pricetag of $4,400): compressor will not turn on. I ordered a replacement compressor controller board so we'll see if that fixes it.

    2. GE french door refrigerator (new pricetag of $3,200): freezer fan not working. I ordered a replacement fan so we'll see if that fixes it.

    3. Kitchenaid double door fridge (older unit, but stainless): runs great for 3 days then quits working unless you unplug it plug it back in. I ordered a new defrost control board.

    4. LG french door fridge (new pricetag of $1,500): units cools! (which for an LG linear compressor unit is a major plus), fans do not run. It for sure is a faulty main board, but it has been replaced once before and I want to get this board issue figured out because I've had numerous LG units with the same issue.

    5. Off brand restaurant mini fridge: Unit compressor is not kicking on. I pulled the board out and replaced a puffed capacitor. Unfortunately, that was only part of the issue. I'm tracking down another part on it and will hopefully have it fixed over the weekend.

    6. Mini wine cooler: transformer is making a lot of noise and the entire unit is not running. I'm actively tracking down the issue on the board.


    When I first started doing appliances I thought fridges were going to be a super complicated thing to work on. Fast forward a few months and the older ones are super basic. The newer ones are challenging, but doable which is interesting. Hopefully when parts come in I can get a few units out the door because they take up a lot of floor space!

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    Newer fridges, led lighting, 12 volt fan motor on the evaporator, electronic thermostat, these items should be easy to diagnose with a decent OHM meter, as for a compressor that runs intermittent this could be a faulty thermo safety disk which is internally attached to the motor winding's.

    A decent clamp on amp meter will let you know how any amps the compressor is drawing on start up, check your findings against the manufactures data sheet, if the compressor uses a start capacitor I would check it's values.

    Older fridges had a start relay attached to the compressor prongs, how the relay worked the copper coil was topside, inside a metal plunger when the compressor tried to start power initially went to both start and run winding's, the copper coil in the relay became energized lifting the metal plunger thus disconnecting the run winding from the circuit.

    From older fridges that had external high side coils attached to the rear, save them. Once you understand the chest freezer you'll understand why.

    The chest freezer looking inside you can see lines of frost forming on the inner walls, this is the low side, now slowly run the palm of your hand down the outside front of the freezer you will find warm spots, this is the high side ( condenser ) where the gas has been returned to a liquid.

    The condenser lines are also located topside of the flooring, when people defrost the freezer, that frost you seen on the inside walls also forms on the backside where you can not see it and what happens if the defrost water settles unnoticed to the bottom where it rots out the steel condenser lines a pin hole is all it take to leak out the freon.

    What I've done in the past is to eliminate the leaking high side, attach the external condenser previously salvaged from an older fridge to the rear of the freezer, don't worry about drilling into any lines when affixing the external condenser because we're excluding the old leaking internal condenser from the system.

    Compressor lines, the smaller one is your high side.

    How to check if your curbside fridge is worth the cost, time and effort, plug it in put an ear onto the cabinet near the freezer compartment, you will hear a spiting sound this will be the freon as its leaving the capillary tube as a liquid fast becoming a gas.

    Check were the previous owner last left the thermostat setting, if its at max that's a good indication the defrost timer is faulty, when the timer goes south the evaporator gets choked with ice and the air can no longer flow through the fins.

    As the defrost timer goes into its defrost cycle there's a heater embedded into the evaporator coil to assist, these heaters are known to burn out and sometimes when they do they'll arc and burn a hole into the evaporator letting out the freon.

    Another thing to look for, water from the defrost cycle goes down a plastic tube,, sometimes a bag of peas or corn will spill inside the freezer some of which finds its way into the drain this blocking it, also check for mold inside the drain tube, spoonful of bleach will kill the mold, another thing to look for make sure the drain tube underneath the fridge is correctly positioned into the drain pan where the water is heated from the compressor to be evaporated adding humidity into the house.

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    Most of the dryers I've worked on either had a heating element burnt out, yea fabric softeners are mostly to blame, broken drum belt, worn glides located front of the drum, once the glides are worn the drum makes noise, metal grinds away leaving the whites discoloured.

    Replacing the heating element, I purchase only the coil, run a string through the insulators, place and end of the new coil in the vise along with an end of the string, now pull the other end of the coil until its the same length as the string. This method is the most economical repair to replace the heating coil.

    While the dryer is dismantled I'll check the door felt and glides if the dryer has drum rollers at the rear check and replace as needed.

    Lint from the dryer will find its way into the lower cabinet this lint will wick the oil from the motor bushings used as bearings, they're cheap for the manufacture to use but the eventual departure of lubricant makes for hard motor starts. dryer motor will refuse to start when the overload protector will not allow the motor to run.

    After removing the lint I'll re-lube the bushings giving the motor an extended life.

    Last edited by alloy2; 01-27-2023 at 10:33 AM.

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    With the washing machine brands listed below, common failure is the rag joint used to couple the motor to transmission.

    Last edited by alloy2; 01-27-2023 at 10:33 AM.

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    Update of the week:

    Over the weekend I posted on one of the local facebook groups that I was interesting in picking up appliances to tinker with. I was figuring I'd get 2-3 appliances. Well...the post blew up and now I have about 60 appliances that people want picked up! I'm a lot less stressed about this volume now that I have a rolloff to work with. I know some will be good and some will be bad. Hopefully the good ones outweigh the bad ones. I'm going to do the pickups for a week or two and see what comes in. Hopefully I have some luck with good ones.

    The results so far:

    1x french door samsung fridge (planning to repair if possible)
    1x older side by side fridge (planning to repair if possible)
    1x black side by side fridge (busted door seal so just scrap)
    1x black side by side fridge (planning to repair if possible)
    1x washing machine (scrap)
    1x glasstop oven (not worth repair, but good parts value)

    Why did I post that I want MORE appliances you may ask? The biggest challenge with appliance repair is getting units in that have no stated symptoms (because it's changed hands multiple times from the installer, to the used appliance store, to me). By picking up directly from the customer, I get a detailed statement of exactly what they've been seeing issue wise. This helps me track down the problem a lot faster.

    The other big reason for picking appliances up: When you have to pay a flat rate on each appliance picked up from the used appliance shop, It's a lot more frustrating when you can't get a unit working and have to junk it. With free appliances, I don't feel as much pressure to get them sold. If I get overwhelmed, I can just toss them into the rolloff and still make money (not as much, but still a positive profit)

    In other news, parts FINALLY arrived for 3 fridges. Parts for a fourth will be in today. I'm going to start getting some of the french door units fixed today so they can start burning in. I will post an update on the 4 fridges tonight when I get parts into them!

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    This thread is very informative, I now know how to obtain used appliances.

    When ever I sold a used appliance would give the buyer some trade in value towards the purchase made from me. I was never short on inventory.

    Thought this thread was going to be on how to diagnose and repair, instead tuned out as click bait.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 406Refining View Post

    3. Kitchenaid double door fridge (older unit, but stainless): runs great for 3 days then quits working unless you unplug it plug it back in. I ordered a new defrost control board.
    Possibly a hard start compressor, have you tested the compressors internal insulation for leakage.


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    My Maytag curbside, easy $500.00.

    Needed a defrost timer.

    The door is convertible, can be changed to open from opposite side, no charge to customer.



    Last edited by alloy2; 02-07-2023 at 08:33 PM.

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    Thank you 406 for this thread. It is nice to see a legit thread, an educational resource, and an example of what the forum should be about. Thank you Alloy 2 for your interest and additions to the thread. Time for the rest of us to step up to the plate.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Patriot76 View Post
    Thank you 406 for this thread. It is nice to see a legit thread, an educational resource, and an example of what the forum should be about. Thank you Alloy 2 for your interest and additions to the thread. Time for the rest of us to step up to the plate.
    I quit the appliance trade when the big stores were offering credit with no payments for 12 months, twenty some odd years later I believe there's a market for used appliances.

    The mechanics have changed, most washing machines now use three phase motors controlled by an onboard inverter which controls motor rotation and speed. Three phase motors do not have start winding's nor any capacitors. Direct drive eliminates the need of a transmission.

    Most issues would be with the electronics on the controller board.

    Front load washing machines have an issue with the spider being eroded by electrolysis, not wroth the cost to repair but those smart drive motors have a following - people purchase them to convert into wind generators.


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    Well...It's been a busy week! I started making headway on my 60 appliances needing to be picked up from my facebook post. Fortunately, (or unfortunately) about 15 were out of my pickup area so that dropped the total down to 45. I picked up about 15 last week. Interesting results so far.

    Fridges:

    The good rule of thumb on fridges is that when plugged in, the freezer should be blowing air in the freezer section. 2x of the fridges were not. I popped one open and the evaporator fan (the fan in the freezer section) was completely seized up. The second one had a busted wire on the coil. What I've found is that if a blower motor fails a continuity, the little copper wires for the motor coil might be broken. A simple soldering of them again fixed the issue.


    This brings me to the other 3 fridges, and 1 oven:

    1. GE side by side fridge. Symptoms: freezer getting slightly cold, but not cold enough.

    I popped the freezer panel off and noticed that only the copper tube coming into the freezer was frosted with the coils not getting cold. I am running it right now, but it's looking to be a low refrigerant situation. The thing about low refrigerant situations is that it leaked out from somewhere. That being said, adding more to the system only pushes the problem off a few years. Usually on units like this, I just part them out and move on as I don't have nitrogen setup for finding leaks yet.

    2. GE side by side fridge. Symptoms: The front control panel is dead, the compressor is not turning on, but the lights inside turn on.

    This one was interesting. On these older GE units there's a red and black wire coming out of the upper left hand connector (usually position 2 and 3 from the left). When probing, there should be 12ish volts. This one was resetting the voltage every second (leading me to believe that something is getting over-voltaged). Needless to say, it's definitely got a bad component on the board. The challenge is that it takes time to track down issues on circuit boards, time that also requires space (something that I don't have at the moment lol). I ordered a replacement board and will get it thrown in shortly.

    3. 1990's white whirlpool fridge. Symptoms: freezer not getting as cold as it should.

    when that starts happening it's usually an issue relating to dust build up, or ice build up. This one was sitting unplugged for about a week and got cold just fine. I'm going to pop the freezer cover off and see if the unit has a faulty defrost sensor or element.

    4. Kenmore (really a Frigidaire) oven. Symptom: bake/broil not working.

    I have dealt with the typical Frigidaire oven board relay burning out often. As a result, I have a full inventory of the 220v relays to fix these issues. I pulled the old relay off, put a new one on, did a little bit of trace repair, and got it fixed. Most ovens have other issues, but anytime I see that style of board, it's usually a relay issue

    I'm learning a ton on these units that is really helping to speed things up on testing/repairing appliances.


    Things that got the white flag of defeat:

    1. LG french door fridge (both fans inside the unit do not spin, unless the unit is put into test mode). I will figure out that issue one of these days, just not when so many appliances are rolling in.

    2. mini wine cooler. I just don't have time to go through the unit that would only bring in $20-$30.

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    Quote Originally Posted by alloy2 View Post
    I quit the appliance trade when the big stores were offering credit with no payments for 12 months, twenty some odd years later I believe there's a market for used appliances.



    The mechanics have changed, most washing machines now use three phase motors controlled by an onboard inverter which controls motor rotation and speed. Three phase motors do not have start winding's nor any capacitors. Direct drive eliminates the need of a transmission.

    Most issues would be with the electronics on the controller board.

    Front load washing machines have an issue with the spider being eroded by electrolysis, not wroth the cost to repair but those smart drive motors have a following - people purchase them to convert into wind generators.

    I never knew you could do that with those big coil motors! I always just left them in the units because of how large and heavy they were for shipping (just not worth selling). Very interesting!

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    Fridges used for remote cottages and RV's, some are offered as 3 way or 2 way the latter is missing one heating component, but operates under the same principals.

    This type of fridge is called an absorption fridge, the refrigerant is water and ammonia.

    Each of the 3 methods be it line voltage from an RV park, 12 volts DC from a battery or a supply of propane they all produce heat, this heat drives the ammonia out of the water reservoir as a gas, ammonia is lighter than air.

    Driven from its home as a gas the ammonia is on a journey to seek out moisture, yea It wants to reunite with that water.

    On this journey the ammonia absorbs heat from the interior, as it exits the gas pass's through a heat exchanger, that weird looking coil located on the rear of the fridge.

    Contrary to popular belief there are no high pressures to deal with, just the obnoxious smell of ammonia should the closed system circuit be breached.

    Most repair shops that repair these units will purchase the core,

    If the RV fridge does not smell of ammonia chances are after sitting idle for a very long time the ammonia has separated from the water and sits as a gas near the top of the closed system, simply turn the fridge upside down to reunite the two.

    The doors are convertible, the front panel depicts the colour scheme by removing the panel on the reverse side you'll find another scheme to choose from.

    Big demand for repairmen, not much required for tools and equipment.

    Last edited by alloy2; 02-08-2023 at 09:45 PM.

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    After repairing a refrigerator and cleaning it up ready for sale. I give the inside a shot of Ozium. This stuff is amazing.

    World famous Ozium, the original air sanitizer with glycol technology. Microscopic spray droplets are hydroscopic (Attract moisture) and attach themselves to odour, smoke, dust and other airborne particles, sweeping the air of objectionable contaminates. Works great in garbage areas & stale smelling fridges. Effectively sanitizes, deodorizes, and leaves a fresh fragrance in the air

    Last edited by alloy2; 02-12-2023 at 09:12 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by alloy2 View Post
    After repairing a refrigerator and cleaning it up ready for sale. I give the inside a shot of Ozium. This stuff is amazing.

    In college this was always on the shopping list. Does wonders when selling a vehicle.

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    I had forgot about ozium. I used it years ago. Great for instant cover up.


    Cheech "did you cut the cheeze?"

    Chong "He who smelt it, dealt it"

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    Quote Originally Posted by alloy2 View Post
    After repairing a refrigerator and cleaning it up ready for sale. I give the inside a shot of Ozium. This stuff is amazing.

    World famous Ozium, the original air sanitizer with glycol technology. Microscopic spray droplets are hydroscopic (Attract moisture) and attach themselves to odour, smoke, dust and other airborne particles, sweeping the air of objectionable contaminates. Works great in garbage areas & stale smelling fridges. Effectively sanitizes, deodorizes, and leaves a fresh fragrance in the air

    Most of the fridges that come in for me are pretty clean so there hasn't been a need for a nuclear option yet. I am totally going to buy a few cans of this! The other thing that some people try apparently is the little charcoal bricks for grilling (something about the carbon neutralizing odors). I haven't tried it yet, but I am totally going to do that as soon as my secondary testing location is set up. I've wanted to set up a spot at home for my "problem fridges" that I can experiment with a few repairs on. Soon....

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