At what point does "wire" stop being wire?

Is wire still defined as wire if it is chopped up in a granulator and now takes the shape of the container it sits in? What if it is smashed flat, and has no actual 'diameter'? Is it now a ribbon? The reason is the state of Arizona among others restricts the buying and selling of 3/8 inch or greater aluminum or copper wire to registered contractors and dealers if the insulation has been stripped off. So a private citizen in possession of valuable stripped copper wire can't sell it legally here. Can't sell wire legally.....but could one sell what used to be wire?

you'll probably want to search the AZ statutes for answers on that one

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Originally Posted by tscrappy

Is wire still defined as wire if it is chopped up in a granulator and now takes the shape of the container it sits in? What if it is smashed flat, and has no actual 'diameter'? Is it now a ribbon? The reason is the state of Arizona among others restricts the buying and selling of 3/8 inch or greater aluminum or copper wire to registered contractors and dealers if the insulation has been stripped off. So a private citizen in possession of valuable stripped copper wire can't sell it legally here. Can't sell wire legally.....but could one sell what used to be wire?

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How about doing what a couple have done and pack it into a flat rate box and ship it to HighVoltage? http://www.scrapmetalforum.com/scrap...astern-pa.html

tscrappy,

I don't know the answer to your question, but here is a link to the ARS.

Paul

Arizona Revised Statutes
See Title 44, Chapter 11, Article 3.1 : Scrap Metal Dealers

yeah, thanks for the advice, but I read the relevant statutes before I asked here. The statutes neither define "wire" nor do they specifically restrict trading in granules or ingots or any other form than stripped wire, except for the record keeping and payment rules. It also prohibits a buyer of wire from altering or stripping the wire for 7 days after the purchase. Again, thanks for the help.

3/8" is some fairly thick wire. When I first read your post, I thought it meant anything "longer" than 3/8" (hence you wanting to granulate it)

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Originally Posted by Bear

3/8" is some fairly thick wire. When I first read your post, I thought it meant anything "longer" than 3/8" (hence you wanting to granulate it)

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Shyeah...shorter than 3/8" is some fairly short wire. lol
the last thing i want to say is this: I understand the goal of this law and others like it, and the last thing i want is some thief tearing up miles of vital infrastructure so he can strip it and then profit from his crimes out in the open with a now unidentifiable spool of basically cash. But these laws were rushed into use by a desperate group of legislators, law enforcement, and utilities. Vague language in laws lead to selective application and creative interpretations that aren't fair. We need balanced and fair regulations that do the best we can to make metal theft unattractive to potential thieves and also allow people to buy and sell a basic commodity like copper without all this crazy bs.

the only thing that will stop a thief from being a thief, is to catch him. And the greatest deterrent is a fear of getting caught

You need to bet a business license and then you can get #1 price. I do not have one and sell as insulated. I did however have a spool of #1 wire and did get paid #1 price for it. I figured they would screw me and give #2. I have yet to figure out if it would make sence to strip and mail away.

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Originally Posted by tscrappy

Shyeah...shorter than 3/8" is some fairly short wire. lol
the last thing i want to say is this: I understand the goal of this law and others like it, and the last thing i want is some thief tearing up miles of vital infrastructure so he can strip it and then profit from his crimes out in the open with a now unidentifiable spool of basically cash. But these laws were rushed into use by a desperate group of legislators, law enforcement, and utilities. Vague language in laws lead to selective application and creative interpretations that aren't fair. We need balanced and fair regulations that do the best we can to make metal theft unattractive to potential thieves and also allow people to buy and sell a basic commodity like copper without all this crazy bs.

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maybe there's something here that might help you; http://www.scrapmetalforum.com/scrap...-sourcing.html

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Originally Posted by Bear

the only thing that will stop a thief from being a thief, is to catch him. And the greatest deterrent is a fear of getting caught

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here in Florida a Glock or 12 guage work pretty well too. {:<{)>

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Originally Posted by tscrappy

Is wire still defined as wire if it is chopped up in a granulator and now takes the shape of the container it sits in? What if it is smashed flat, and has no actual 'diameter'? Is it now a ribbon? The reason is the state of Arizona among others restricts the buying and selling of 3/8 inch or greater aluminum or copper wire to registered contractors and dealers if the insulation has been stripped off. So a private citizen in possession of valuable stripped copper wire can't sell it legally here. Can't sell wire legally.....but could one sell what used to be wire?

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Do you get lots of wire that's over 3/8" ?

Format Document

B. A scrap metal dealer shall not accept aluminum wire with a diameter of at least three-eighths of an inch or any copper wire that has had the insulation removed and shall not remove the insulation from the wire until after the seven day period prescribed by section 44-1644, subsection D.

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Originally Posted by hobo finds

Format Document

B. A scrap metal dealer shall not accept aluminum wire with a diameter of at least three-eighths of an inch or any copper wire that has had the insulation removed and shall not remove the insulation from the wire until after the seven day period prescribed by section 44-1644, subsection D.

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Ah, thanks for that. I didn't realize I had totally misstated that critical sentence. Of course all stripped copper wire is non-buyable except by licensees. Only the big aluminum wire is covered because of it's use in high voltage transmisson lines and such.

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Originally Posted by tscrappy

...all stripped copper wire is non-buyable except by licensees. Only the big aluminum wire is covered because of it's use in high voltage transmisson lines and such.

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I read the statute direct link here and it would seem that you can't even strip lampcord...wow. People's Republic of Arizona!

As an aside, a lot of houses built during the 1970s have aluminum conductors from the meter that probably hit the 3/8 diameter.